Brake pedal goes to the floor - Page 7 - Honda Pioneer Forum
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post #61 of 67 Old 01-24-2014, 10:22 AM
jar
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Originally Posted by NevadaWalt View Post
Yes Jar I got mine at the Carson store. They are good to work with. I also have had a brake issue from the time I got the unit. One time it happened after it had been sitting for 10-15 minutes (not after heavy breaking) and I went to back it up. The store wants it back as soon as possible.

Moose, didn't you say you had adequate clearance from the A-arm guard to the brake hose? I have the same guard and have enough clearance to get a zip tie between the guard and any part of the brake system.


I hope you can get the machine in to the dealer to have it fixed sooner rather than later.

Am I correct in assuming your brake issue is intermittent as others have reported. These types of problems are so hard to find sometimes.

When you get it fixed, please report via this thread, as the more information about problems and fixes the better for all of us.

Thanks to all who have given input to this thread and hope to hear from those who have reported the brake problem but have not weighted in yet.

Jay
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post #62 of 67 Old 01-24-2014, 11:02 AM
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Walt,

If your running the problematic A Arm guards, I have devised a little testing for it.

I had emailed this to a few people that contacted me privately about the brakes issue, I sort of forgot about posting it here. Off board we came up with this through some trial and error. It's a good test to see if you indeed have a brake issue or just a poorly clearanced A arm guard. 90% of the time! it's the guards or those plastic guards over the caliper that caused it.

TEST METHOD
""""
if you just sit at an idle in your Pioneer and hit the brake pedal, let off it, then crank all the way one direction, hold the steering wheel there and depress the brake pedal again. Do that for both directions. If you see fade to the pedal with it cranked in either direction, there is a bind on the caliper or its line opposite as the way you turned.

you won't necessarily notice right after turning your wheels when doing regular driving. any pressure to one of the front calipers lines can cause fade for the next time you hit the brakes.

If any of the above shows a problem, I'd remove those plastic caliper covers, its just two 10mm bolts on each side, then try the process again to see if that clears it up. If it doesn't I'd check a arm guard clearance next

hope that makes sense.""""

I never heard anything back from the ones I emailed this to. I'm guessing it worked.




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post #63 of 67 Old 01-24-2014, 12:14 PM
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Will give it a try and let you know.

Thanks
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post #64 of 67 Old 01-24-2014, 01:29 PM
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For more clarification, my problem was intermittent. I tried Moose's test described above. Sure enough when I turned the steering one way I lost brake pedal. Removed the plastic caliper cover and tried the same test and no problems. I did notice that the plastic cover on both sides had been contacting the A-arm guard. With the plastic guard off I had the wife hold the wheel as far left as possible, the direction I lost pedal pressure and checked to see if the A-arm guard was in contact with any of the rest of the wheel or brake system. I had good clearance. If I cut much more of the plastic cover away I will lose the integrity of the cover. I am thinking of trimming the A-arm guard. If you look at the Honda OME guard you notice it does not have the front wing. Any ideas on trimming the guard?

Does anybody have any experience or has had trouble with the Honda guard?

Thanks Moose I think you hit the nail on the head. Now what to do to fix the problem.
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post #65 of 67 Old 01-24-2014, 01:38 PM
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Just ditch the plastic covers Walt. You know I took the time to trim mine all up. Then the first deep snow I hit this winter, they packed full and started putting pressure on the hose.

I apologize for not posting that test earlier Walt. I thought I had, but apparently I was confusing emails I wrote with posts.




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post #66 of 67 Old 01-24-2014, 02:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Moose View Post
Walt,

If your running the problematic A Arm guards, I have devised a little testing for it.

I had emailed this to a few people that contacted me privately about the brakes issue, I sort of forgot about posting it here. Off board we came up with this through some trial and error. It's a good test to see if you indeed have a brake issue or just a poorly clearanced A arm guard. 90% of the time! it's the guards or those plastic guards over the caliper that caused it.

TEST METHOD
""""
if you just sit at an idle in your Pioneer and hit the brake pedal, let off it, then crank all the way one direction, hold the steering wheel there and depress the brake pedal again. Do that for both directions. If you see fade to the pedal with it cranked in either direction, there is a bind on the caliper or its line opposite as the way you turned.

you won't necessarily notice right after turning your wheels when doing regular driving. any pressure to one of the front calipers lines can cause fade for the next time you hit the brakes.

If any of the above shows a problem, I'd remove those plastic caliper covers, its just two 10mm bolts on each side, then try the process again to see if that clears it up. If it doesn't I'd check a arm guard clearance next

hope that makes sense.""""

I never heard anything back from the ones I emailed this to. I'm guessing it worked.
Moose,

This is great information and why I said that the problem sounded like a design or installation issue. It didn't make much sense to me that so many people would be having that issue for it to be regular part failure.

I know that you have been regularly complimented on the forum regarding your knowledge and willingness to help the other guy but I would like to add my thanks to the list.

I don't know what the process would be for you to be added to the list of moderators but you would have my vote along with the many others.

I think this is the type of information that should be made into a "sticky" is there anything you can do about making that happen? I have no idea how one would go about that.

I also think your Switch panel should be a sticky as well. Maybe Honda should hire you as a design consultant.

Jay
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post #67 of 67 Old 02-22-2016, 09:40 PM
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I know this an old thread and I am new to this forum, but I had the exact symptoms on here and Moose's test worked for me to solve my problem. It was the black plastic guard hitting my A-arm guards.

So I am just chiming in and bumping this thread in case anyone else is experiencing brake loss on their Pioneer. I am glad I found this thread because I was getting ready to take the brake system apart to figure this out. Happy it was an easy fix to remove the plastic guards!
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